Subject: Re: CROW TAXONOMY QUESTION (fwd)
Date: Mar 1 17:23:10 1994
From: Eugene Hunn - hunn at u.washington.edu

Al,

I agree on the towhees but feel the crow situation may have more in
common with song sparrows, juncos, flickers, etc. I have long urged
someone at the University to find a student wishing to do a thesis on the
questions. The obvious starting point would be a systematic analysis of
vocalizations.

Gene Hunn.

On Fri, 25 Feb 1994 Alvaro Patricio Jaramillo <jaramill at sfu.ca> wrote:
>
> Regarding the crow question:
>
> I lived in Ontario (American Crow only of course) for many years and
> moved to Vancuver in September. When I arrived I was amazed at how
> DIFFERRENT Northwestern Crows were from Ontario Amrerican Crows. Its not
> the size that stands out but the proportions, NW Crow have really short
> legs and tiny feet. They waddle when they walk on turf, unlike the American
> Crow. The bills are very small as well. The main "caaw" call is similar
> in both species, but differs in tone. All of the other weird calls I
> hae heard from NW Crows I had never heard in Ontario. The social structure
> may be different, the mean group size is bigger in NW Crow. In Ontario,
> crows are common in cities but they are not a really urban bird like the
> NW Crow, but this may be a function of their size.
>
> I realize that comparing crows from the opposite side of the continent is
> in error, and that going inland in B.C. to look at American Crows is
> more proper, but nevertheless the ends of the distribution are really different.
> Now we have to establish if its a gradual cline, step cline or actually
> not a cline at all. I am surprised that no one has tackled this question
> using Mitochondrial DNA or some other molecular technique. In Europe, the
> hybrid zone between Carrion and Hooded Crows is a stable step cline, and
> they could probably be considered different species depending on your pet
> species concept.
>
> In any case, I look forward to going into the interior to look at crows this
> summer. BTW- as long as we are on this topic, my opinion is that there is
> no way that the Spotted Towhee is the Same thing as an Eastern Rufous-
> sided Towhee. The only similarity is the rufous on the sides and the fact
> that they are towhees, all of the calls I have heard are different.
>
> Al Jaramillo
> jaramill at sfu.ca
> Vancouver, B.C.