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Date: Thu, 3 Mar 1994 14:20:14 -0800 (PST)
From: Dan Victor <dvictor at u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: CROW TAXONOMY QUESTION
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Date: 03 Mar 94 14:00
From:Skip_Russell at beav.intersolv.com

> I am really surprised that the NW Crow question has not been tackled
>by any one of the DNA gurus, or has it and I don't know about it. The

Unless and until there is some genetic data to go on, the point would seem
to me to be moot. Furthermore, it seems that if relatively recent factors
were responsible for the breaking down of whatever isolating mechanims
existed between caurinus and hesperis, then a mixing of genes couldn't
possibly account for a continuous cline as far south as California, at
least not in the that time frame. Perhaps a more plausible explanation
would be that whatever environmental factors led to caurinus in the first
place, also confer the same selective advantage to coastal hesperis? For
example, small size might be an advantage in competing with beachcombing
gulls or blackbirds or something. In other words, small size in Crows
might just be the inevitable byproduct of living by the sea?

...........Perhaps birders should take
>hold of this idea and create a "Birding species concept", if you can ID
>it then you can count it! How does that sound?

It has a lot of merit. I think Al Jaramillo's concept will be given more
serious consideration when the inevitable Red Crossbill split occurs. It
looks as though we will then be faced with species which we won't be able
to identify in the field! It works for splits as well as lumps.

Skip