>Nevertheless, we can see that starlings are now common there, and western
>bluebirds are no less common than they were 45 years ago.

In the case of bluebirds in the PDX Metro area, at least, Dave Marshall
cites urbanization as a (the?) cause. Speaking of his boyhood, he talks
of going to the east side of the city, to the Mt. Tabor area (about a
mile east of my home) to see them. Of course, in those days (late 20s,
30s) this area was semi-rural.

In the PDX area, bluebirds are still found in similar semi-rural areas.
The bluebird trail folk talk about shaking house sparrow eggs they find
in bluebird boxes, not starling...

>Without a statistical analysis it seems clear to me that starling numbers
>don't have much to do with bluebird numbers, at least at Eugene

In winter...be precise. Not that I'm really disagreeing with you, but
regarding CBCs, we must remember the meaning of that intial "C".

>Any more fuel to add to this fire, or light to shed?

I'd sure like to get dave marshall on-line. He has both the technical
training and the historical perspective to contribute much to such
discussions.

- Don Baccus, Portland OR <donb at rational.com>