Reply below in CAPITAL LETTERS to allow easy reading contrast.
Maureen Ellis me2 at u.washington.edu Univ of WA and Des Moines, WA
********************ME2's Commentary Below*******************************
On Wed, 4 Jun 1997, Martin Muller wrote:

> Maureen, fellow tweetsters,
>
> Before we get into doomsday predictions on the future of Great Blue
> Heron(ries) due to expanding Bald Eagle populations, let me remind you that
THE FACTS ARE THAT IN THIS AREA OF THE PUGET SOUND COAST LINE, THE HERONS
ARE PROVING EASY, PROFITABLE PREY TO THE EAGLES, AND MANY LOCAL HERONRIES
HAVE NOT YET ADAPTED. THEY HAVE FAILED TO PRODUCE CHICKS (the next
small print within ( ) is me2's aside comment.....in Des Moines, in Salt
Water Park, in others; yes, information is fragmented because there are
not enough people out there doing consistent monitoring, but the evidence
here is "in your face!".)
***********Martin's commentary continues...........
>I seem to recall reports from a few years back (2?) on the Renton (?)
>heronry,
> where within one season several herons started to stand their ground
(nest)
> against an eagle periodically (every four days?) visiting the heronry and
> consuming eggs/heron chicks. Is that the same "old south King County heronry"
> Thais Bock mentioned?
I AM GETTING A CONFIRMATION NOW OF THE EXACT NAME/LOCATION OF THIS LARGE,
RECENTLY FAILED HERONRY. WHAT IS UNUSUAL HERE IS THAT THIS HERONRY HAS
BEEN SUCCESSFUL FOR YEARS, PERHAPS DECADES. >

> I am not saying that watching a particular Bald Eagle, or even several of
> them, wipe out a heronry is not disturbing. THIS COMMENT IS IRRELEVANT
AND SOMEWHAT CHAUVINISTIC. A SCIENTIST CAN HAVE AN EMOTIONAL REACTION TO
AN EVENT, NOTE IT, AND CONTINUE GATHERING INFORMATION THAT APPROACHES THE
TRUTH. I DO HAVE STRONG NEGATIVE REACTIONS TO THE LACK OF PUBLIC INSIGHT
CONCERNING HUMAN OVER-POPULATION IMPACT ON SUCH THINGS AS PREDATOR-PREY
RELATIONSHIPS IN NON-HUMAN SPECIES. PERHAPS IT IS NOT INSIGHT AS MUCH AS
IT IS RELUCTANCE TO MAKE THE HARD POLITICAL DECISIONS ABOUT LIMITING HUMAN
REPRODUCTIVE FREEDOM.........but back to immediate issue of eagles/herons.

> I just wonder if it has more to do
> with individual eagles and perhaps location and size of heronries and, last
> but probably not least, fragmented and disturbed habitat for both species.
> I.e. smaller, open trees where the herons nest, being more accessible to
> eagles. Just a thought...
I BELIEVE THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT I SAID IN MY ORIGINAL POST WITHIN THE
FRAMEWORK OF BEHAVIORAL ECOLOGY/POPULATION DYNAMICS.
> I certainly wouldn't want to go as far as to "suspect there'll be a drastic
> decline of our NW coastal herons."
AGAIN, THIS HAS ALREADY HAPPENED IN A LOCAL AREA WITH LONG ESTABLISHED
HERON POPULATIONS. THE BALD EAGLE RECOVERY IS A RECENT PHENOMENON TO
WHICH HERON POPULATIONS WILL HAVE TO RE-ADAPT. A MARKED DECLINE OF EASILY
ACCESSIBLE (TO THE EAGLES) HERON PREY IS BOUND TO OCCUR OVER THE SHORT
TERM AS THE "NATURAL ORDER OF THINGS." HOW THE OVERALL GBH POPULATIONS
WILL ADJUST AND STABILIZE OVER THE LONGER TERM IN THIS AREA IS AN
INTERESTING DARWIAN QUESTION. THE DYNAMICS OF THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN
TWO EQUALLY SUCCESSFUL NESTING PREDATORS, I.E., THE EAGLES OF DISCOVERY
PARK AND THE NEARBY GBHeronry IS A FASCINATING CONTRAST. PERHAPS
THE EAGLES HAVE OTHER EASY PREY AND THE LOCAL HERONS ARE HIGHLY
AGGRESSIVE.......more research clearly needed as the statement goes.
Maureen Ellis, U of WA and Des Moines, WA
******************************************************************
> > > Martin Muller, Seattle > martinmuller at msn.com >