Hi All,

There is the legal, and then there is the practical and real world. I grew up in rural Pennsylvania and my uncle was a farmer and a landowner. In my younger years, it was virtually impossible to find posted property in the counties surrounding my uncle's farm. A time-honored unwritten rule, however, was universally applied by the landowners - everyone was expected to ask permission to hunt, fish or do anything on someone else's land, regardless of whether the land was posted or not simply because it was the right thing to do. Permission was virtually always given when the tradition was honored. [Or sometimes not given for very good reason, a personal example being - "No, you can't go down in that woodlot. I've got a 600 pound sow with 12 piglets that got loose. She's running around down there and will come after you if you get near the babies. I don't want you to get hurt."]

Time passed and people moved into the area. Some neither knew nor respected the established tradition - some, unfortunately, also didn't respect the land. The old time landowners noticed and the usual scenario followed - a minority of people over time spoiled things for the majority. In the course of a decade or so, it became much more common to see posted property and more requests to enter someone's land were answered in the negative. I just returned from two family trips to that same area earlier this year and drove through the countryside I grew up in as a kid. I did not see a single farm or wooded tract that wasn't prominently plastered with No Trespassing signs. My birding was done from roads and in public parks.

The moral of the story for me is - legally you may be able to go onto unposted private property, but doing so routinely will eventually result in the loss of unposted property and in far fewer landowners being willing to allow anyone they don't know personally on their land. It has happened back East quicker simply because there is less land available relative to the population.

If it's really that hot a birding spot, find the landowner, establish rapport and ask politely. Everyone will be better off for it in the long run. Another simple rule of thumb - when you're stopped along a rural road anywhere and someone drives up or by, ALWAYS smile and wave first before the car stops or goes by. I cannot tell you how many times I have done that proactively while doing rural photography when the person in the car turned out to be a landowner or a neighbor wondering what the stranger with all the equipment was doing out by the north 40. In the majority of cases, my initial greeting set the tone and resulted in a very pleasant conversation that might otherwise have been only neutral or negative. Further, the result of taking a few minutes for conversation often results in helpful suggestions about other places to go. Local folks in rural areas (like east of the mountains in WA) expect other local folks to wave. They don't expect that from "206-ers" an!
d by do
ing so, you tilt things in a positive direction right off the bat.

My two cents...

John Tubbs
Snoqualmie, WA
johntubbs at comcast.net
www.tubbsphoto.com


-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Roger M. Leed" <rmleed at pipeline.com>

> I must disagree. Many private landowners freely permit the public to have
> access to their property. A property is posted in order to show the implied
> permission has been withdrawn. Likewise, a gated fence shows an intent to
> exclude. Remember the open range? Therefore, vacant private forest or
> range land is generally available for public use unless posted otherwise.
> Property owners are not necessarily aware of these rules, and some may
> refuse to abide by them, so I am not encouraging birders to argue with a
> property owner. Nor should anyone disregard a "No Trespassing" sign. But
> you are not violating the law, or committing a crime, by going on vacant,
> open, unposted private land for the purpose of looking for birds. Don't do
> any damage, of course.
>
> Roger M. Leed
> Law Offices of R. M. Leed P.S.
> 1826 E. Hamlin St.
> Seattle, WA 98112-2006
> (206) 443-9911
> fax: (206) 330-2131
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dennis Rockwell [mailto:dennrockwell at surfbest.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 6:28 PM
> To: tweeters
> Subject: Re: [Tweeters] Reecer Creek Warning
>
> Tweeters,
>
> I'll add to Mike's comment: ALL LAND is private unless otherwise posted.
> Private property owners are under NO OBLIGATION to build fences or post
> signs notifying the general public that trespassing is prohibited on private
> property - entry onto ANY land that is not public is trespassing unless you
> a warrent or specific permission of the property owner/s. On the other
> hand, if you are on a public right-of-way and aren't blocking traffic, etc.,
> you have a perfect right to be there.
> I have had cranky self-proclaimed property owners try to tell me that I
> couldn't stand on the shoulder of a public road and look onto private
> property to view birds, etc. Those of you who know me best can guess how I
> reacted to that suggestion.
>
> Dennis Rockwell
> Kennewick, WA
> dennrockwell at surfbest.net
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "mike denny"
> To: "tweeters" ; "Grant Hendrickson"
>
> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 5:06 PM
> Subject: Re: [Tweeters] Reecer Creek Warning
>
>
> > Hello Grant,
> > Were you along Reser Creek southeast of Walla Walla? Were you off the road
>
> > out in a field or along side a field? All land in Walla Walla County is
> > private land unless otherwise posted.
> > Later Mike
> >
> > ********************************************************************
> > Mike & MerryLynn Denny
> > 1354 S. E. Central Ave.
> > College Place, WA 99324
> > 509.529.0080 (h)
> >
> > IF YOU HAVEN'T BEEN BIRDING, YOU HAVEN'T LIVED!
> > *******************************************************************
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Tweeters mailing list
> > Tweeters at u.washington.edu
> > http://mailman1.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/tweeters
>
>
>
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