Thanks Ed,

I have to admit that I was clearly unable to decide what to think about that photoessay, partially based on the fact that I was not there taking those images, but partially because I am a human being who cannot imagine what an animal (or even another human) thinks/feels, and partially because I am a scientist who has been taught to believe that animals have few thoughts or feelings (beyond the most basic: thirst, hunger, sex and a few others).

However, I have lived with birds -- parrots and passerines -- and have rehabbed birds, and I have seen that there is an unexplained "something" that animals, especially birds, possess .. and I do see birds who exhibit the most astonishingly empathetic behaviors towards each other and occasionally towards humans as well .. while this is NOT a reason to believe that birds have an emotional life that is equivalent to that of humans, it strongly suggests that birds are cognizant that other animals, including humans, do possess an emotional life, which suggests that they too, have some sort of emotional life (otherwise, how would they know such a thing exists?).

anyway, I need to get going to talk with Irene Pepperberg at her hotel this morning! This shall be fascinating. Maybe I'll ask her what her thoughts are about the barn swallows?

cheers,

GrrlScientist
Devorah
http://scienceblogs.com/grrlscientist/
Roosting high up a tree somewhere in Central Park, NYC


--- On Mon, 11/3/08, Ed Newbold <ednewbold1 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> From: Ed Newbold <ednewbold1 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [Tweeters] Case not closed on Barn Swallow series
> To: tweeters at u.washington.edu
> Date: Monday, November 3, 2008, 2:40 AM
> Hi all,
> ?
> I wish to point out that there has been no truly persuasive
> case made that the Barn Swallows in the set of pictures that
> Devorah kindly linked to--
> ?
> ?
> http://scienceblogs.com/grrlscientist/2008/10/one_of_lifes_tiny_dramas.php
> ?
> was certainly ?a case of necrophilia or the taking
> advantage of a dying swallow by another?and/or?that it
> had absolutely no component of grieving or something like
> it.
> ?
> ?
> You don?t need to be a credentialed scientist to realize
> that more is needed to be known about the specific birds in
> the picture, and more about the sequence in question and
> perhaps more about Barn Swallow behavior to arrive at a
> certain conclusion as to actually what is going on in those
> pictures.? Some scientific humility is clearly called for.
> ?
> The need to make a truly scientific case cuts both ways,
> not only to people proposing so-called ?anthropomorphic?
> interpretations of events ?but also to those who would
> categorically rule them out as explanations.
> ?
> Thanks again to Devorah.
> ?
> Ed Newbold ?ednewbold1 at yahoo.com Beacon Hill Seattle
>
>
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