Don,

You asked for further comments from "everyone," but it doesn't sound like you are very receptive to the majority of comments that have been posted.

A bunch of people have now posted about how bird banders approach their activities, with the thought of the birds' welfare uppermost in their minds. I have banded birds and know lots of banders, and I know that's the case.

If there are a few uncaring banders, please do not criticize bird-banding because of them (I'm speaking to everyone here, not just Don). People are responsible or not; irresponsibility is not a characteristic of particular activities. Why do we end up castigating the small numbers of irresponsible birders, irresponsible photographers, irresponsible bird feeders, irresponsible cat owners, ad infinitum, when we could be praising the responsible ones? Positive reinforcement, please!

To say that because only one banded dipper was found again in a banding study means that all the others died because of their bands is the worst kind of fear-mongering, based on no evidence whatsoever and akin to the stuff you see on political news and commentaries and blogs that try to influence voters. Appeal to their emotions, and you've got 'em. And be sure to end your sentences with "And that is an absolute fact!" whether you really know what you are talking about or not. I guess you didn't believe the people who sent you examples of successful studies on dippers that used banded birds.

You wrote "If a bird is banded and never seen again, then it has to be that the bird died because of being banded and it cannot be disputed because there is no evidence to the contrary." This is a blatant misconception. Banded birds being recaptured or resighted is entirely dependent on the situation. Many birds are banded in migration, when they are on their way somewhere else. Just-fledged birds are often banded, and they are about to leave for a new territory. Indeed the handling may prompt them to leave that immediate spot but in no way affects their survival. And of course some of them suffer natural mortality, always high on small birds.

The placement of words in sentences is important. You could have said "not all banders and researchers will report any death," and instead you said "all banders and researchers will not report any death." I hope that was a slip of the pen and not intentional.

I would like to make a request for you to simmer down on this subject. It's devolving into an animal-rights vs science argument, and that has happened again and again over the years and is unlikely to be resolved. Are you keeping this going because you think you can stop the banding of dippers for research? You've already been told that a band on a dipper is no more dangerous to the bird than a band on a tree-living species, and that seems entirely sensible to me. I don't quite understand your motivation here. Do you want to raise a ground swell of objection to all bird banding?

I am sending this to all of tweeters, because the discussion has been online. I apologize to the list owners for being confrontational, but every once in a while, I feel such a response coming on.

Dennis Paulson

On Apr 6, 2012, at 10:13 AM, Don Wallace wrote:

> Hi Folks,
>
>
>
> I have gotten a good number of responses to my post, and I would like to keep getting more.
> The responses have been on both side of the fence. Those that have been for banding birds mostly say that there is no harm to the birds.
>
> My response to that is: all banders and researchers will not report any death caused by netting or banding.
>
> If a bird is banded and never seen again, then it has to be that the bird died because of being banded and it cannot be disputed because there is no evidence to the contrary. So if every person that bands a bird can account for all the birds where a bouts, then they should do so, otherwise those missing birds have died because of being banded, only the lucky survive. And that is an absolute fact!
>
> I was sent a link to a website where one person has banded 50 dippers, but can only account for one. 49 died just to watch one grow old. How fortunate is that?
>
>
> Keep the comments coming, I would like to hear from everyone.
>
> Don
> don at e-picturebookdesigners.com_______________________________________________
> Tweeters mailing list
> Tweeters at u.washington.edu
> http://mailman1.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/tweeters

-----
Dennis Paulson
1724 NE 98 St.
Seattle, WA 98115
206-528-1382
dennispaulson at comcast.net



-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman1.u.washington.edu/pipermail/tweeters/attachments/20120406/d3c8567b/attachment.htm