Appreciate the discussion, Steve.

A second point of confusion is that WDFW lists
<https://wdfw.wa.gov/species-habitats/species/lagopus-leucurus-saxatilis#resources>
"our" White-tailed Ptarmigan as *Lagopus leucurus saxatilis*. As far as I
can tell, *saxatilis* is the subspecies endemic to Vancouver Island. I
wondered if it once used to be conspecific with the Mt. Rainier
White-tailed Ptarmigan (*L.l.rainierensis*), but I don't see any evidence
to corroborate that guess. Oddly, on the same page, WDFW references a
thorough resource on White-tailed Ptarmigan that clearly describes
*rainierensis* as the subspecies of White-tailed Ptarmigan across the
Cascades, to the Canadian border (pgs 21-25 of this document
<https://ecos.fws.gov/ServCat/DownloadFile/202270>).

Stephen Chase
Everson

On Wed, Jul 3, 2024 at 2:40 PM Steve Loitz via Tweeters <
tweeters at u.washington.edu> wrote:


> I seek to clear up confusion re WDFW's statements re White-tailed

> Ptarmigan, the Mt. Rainier subspecies of which has recently

> received enhanced ESA protection, which is a good thing.

>

> WDFW's webpage

> <https://wdfw.wa.gov/species-habitats/species/lagopus-leucurus-saxatilis#desc-range> re

> the WTPT re the WTPT seems to make inconsistent claims-- WDFW claims

> that "[t]he Washington population may be about 1,000 individuals"

>

> -- but in the immediately preceding paragraph, WDFW states that the

> species is "common in areas further north, such as the Pasayten

> Wilderness."

>

> How can a bird with only 1,000 individuals state-wide be deemed "common"

> in a relatively small geographic subset of the state?

>

> Furthermore, the "1,000 individuals" claim is contrary to my experience,

> which I acknowledge to be anecdotal, but nonetheless relevant. I've been

> mountaineering and birding in the WA Cascades for 40 years, have seen

> hundreds of WTPT and, although I do acknowledge the long-term threat of

> climate change, I have not noted any material decline in the numbers of

> WTPT north of I-90. WTPTs are a common sight in the NCNP on both sides of

> SR20, e.g., Pickets, Steattle Ridge, Isolation Traverse, Bacon/Hagan/Blum

> area, Ragged Ridge, Mt. Logan massif, and also in the Glacier Peak WA,

> Chelan/Sawtooths, Pasayten WA and other areas.

>

> WDFW acknowledges that [t]here has been little work done with [the

> species in WA]."

>

> What's going on here? WDFW's claim is not qualified by subspecies and,

> AFAIK, the Mt. Rainier subspecies is the only WTPT subspecies in the WA

> Cascades.

>

> On what sampling does WDFW rely for the "1,000 individuals" claim? Many,

> very possibly most, WTPT reside in areas which see little human traffic

> and, based on my considerable experience mountaineering in WA's WTPT

> habitat, those areas very likely get virtually zero eBirders.

>

> This is not the first time I've been addled by claimed data which reflects

> the very small overlap of birders and deep wilderness travelers, but it's

> the most mindboggling.

>

> Steve Loitz

> Ellensburg, WA

> steveloitz at gmail.com

> _______________________________________________

> Tweeters mailing list

> Tweeters at u.washington.edu

> http://mailman11.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/tweeters

>