Thank you, Gary. That is reflective of the way I have always counted for
ebird purposes.
Louise Rutter
Kirkland
On Tue, Jan 28, 2025 at 8:59 AM <
gsmith at smithandstark.com> wrote:
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From eBird:
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https://support.ebird.org/en/support/solutions/articles/48000838845
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*Birds at feeders*
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Whether your feeder is nectar-filled and aswarm with frantically feeding
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hummingbirds or a thistle tube liberally coated with finches, it can be
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hard to know how many birds are truly there. We recommend reporting the highest
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number of individuals seen at one time during the observation period, as
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well as any clearly different individuals. Although there may actually be
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more individuals, it's the most reliable method for these situations.
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Obviously if you see 6 female Northern Cardinals and 3 males, and later see
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6 males together, then you have at least 12 different cardinals at your
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feeder, and your checklist should reflect this.
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Gary T. Smith
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Boise, ID (formerly Seattle)
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*From:* Tweeters <tweeters-bounces at mailman11.u.washington.edu> *On Behalf
>
Of *Dennis Paulson via Tweeters
>
*Sent:* Tuesday, January 28, 2025 9:18 AM
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*To:* Greg <gjpluth at gmail.com>
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*Cc:* Louise <louiserutter1000 at gmail.com>; TWEETERS tweeters <
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tweeters at u.washington.edu>
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*Subject:* Re: [Tweeters] Reporting - was "new yard bird"
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Hello tweeters,
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>
I hope there are no projects in which people are really encouraged to
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"count every bird," as in the course of a birding day (or hour), you may
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see the very same bird again and again (a wren in your yard, an eagle on a
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tree you pass coming and going, a harrier flying over the same field three
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hours apart), and that would be very misleading.
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On the other hand, it does put the onus on us to think about the birds we
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are seeing. If we know we have only one wren, then we are sure that it is
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the same bird. If we drive past the tree two or three times, we have no
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reason to believe it isn't the same eagle. So we would count "one" each
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time. I guess they are just saying that it is our responsibility to keep
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track of the birds we see as well as we can. And I would go for one
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harrier, not two, even though I saw them at different times. Unless of
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course they were in different plumages, another important factor to keep
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track of when counting birds.
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There are so many cases in which these hard decisions have to be made. You
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drop by a particular shoreline and there are about 100 Dunlins feeding
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there. You come back three hours later, and there are about 25. Did a
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predator take 75 of them? Did 75 fly away and leave their flock mates? Or
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it a different flock, and you should tally 125? My thought would always be
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to be conservative and assume the other 75 were somewhere else.
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I think it is always best to give minimum numbers, not maximum numbers.
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We're not doing the ornithological record or bird conservation any service
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by overcounting, nor by overestimating.
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Dennis Paulson
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Seattle
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On Jan 27, 2025, at 11:05 PM, Greg via Tweeters <tweeters at u.washington.edu>
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wrote:
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>
Hi Louise and Jim -
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>
Since I am not privy to the complete conversation with Cornell, my feeling
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is that it might be best to question them again for clarification on the
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specifics mentioned here regarding counting every observation even if very
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likely it's a repeat. Obviously we all are trying to gather a true picture
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with our counting.
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I have seen a Bewick's Wren occasionally near my feeders every day for
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several weeks now. I've never seen two simultaneously during this time. If
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I stood at my kitchen window for a long periods, I'm sure I would see it on
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multiple occasions in the course of a day. It would certainly be misleading
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and bad science to count it on every occasion.
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I believe it is important to paint a true picture of numbers of birds
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especially when submitting to eBird. I rely on the information in eBird
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when birding excursions take me to unfamiliar places. I hope we're all on
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the same page in this regard.
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Greg Pluth
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University Place
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Sent from my iPhone
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On Jan 27, 2025, at 9:01 PM, Louise via Tweeters <
>
tweeters at u.washington.edu> wrote:
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Many thanks for all these details, Jim.
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My criteria for keeping my own personal yard list are definitely my own. I
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want to know which birds are using the habitat I provide, not every bird
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that might pass through the general area.
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When I'm listing for ebird or whatever, I do make note of every bird I
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see/hear, however distant. It's interesting, though, that Cornell encourage
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us to count every bird, even when it's highly likely to be a repeat. My
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tendency in those circumstances has been to count the minimum number of
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birds rather than the maximum, because I have indeed been worried about
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over-counting. Certainly on the CBCs I've been on, I've been encouraged to
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count that way to avoid over-counting.
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Does anyone know of there are specific criteria for CBCs that differ from
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those of Cornell?
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Louise Rutter
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Kirkland
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On Sun, Jan 26, 2025 at 12:24 PM via Tweeters <tweeters at u.washington.edu>
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wrote:
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>
Louise,
>
>
Back when I was first starting to use eBird I asked this specific
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question
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about my checklists. Specifically - "when do you report (count) a bird?"
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and gave the example of my backyard feeder and the fact that I could
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see birds coming and going ... but suspected - highly - that some/many
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of them were 'repeats' and had been there as short a time ago as only a
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few minutes.
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The answer I got was "if you don't know for certain it is the same bird -
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count it". So even if you have a group of say 10 finches that are coming
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and going from your yard/feeder - the advice is to count them "every time
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you see them that you, personally, can't say it is the same bird".
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This advice is not just about birds in our backyards. And Cornell
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doesn't consider it "over counting" (probably because you will also
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miss many birds that might visit your backyard when you do something
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as seemingly insignificant as just getting another cup of coffee).
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There are similar considerations for 2 or more people all seeing and
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reporting the -same- bird ... perhaps even birding together.
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>
So here is my take/interpretation of this advice. As long as everyone is
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using pretty much the same methods - it doesn't matter ... because
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what the science is about is the changes - over time and even over
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relatively long periods of time. Such as from one season to the next or
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one year to the next or one decade to the next.
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We all know about events such as "irruptions" and "long term trends"
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etc.
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===> If we have lots of data (reports) then it all averages out in ways
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that wouldn't be true for just a few reports (total number of
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checklist).
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But there -are- lots of checklists being done in all kinds of situations.
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So report what you can ID and let the citizen science work out what it
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means. Even reports such as "Gull, species" are valuable/useful -
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especially when compared to no reports at all?
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>
- Jim in Skagit
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>
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>
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>
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>
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>
>
_______________________________________________
>
Tweeters mailing list
>
Tweeters at u.washington.edu
>
http://mailman11.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/tweeters
>
>
_______________________________________________
>
Tweeters mailing list
>
Tweeters at u.washington.edu
>
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>
>
>